Sales v's marketing

[scotserve]

I got into a discussion in a business forum a few years ago, where the owner of the forum reckoned that Sales and Marketing were the same thing, I disagreed as I feel marketing is the manner in which the products are brought to market and sales is the conclusion of the supply of the product.
This generated so diverse opinions so wondered what you thought while in a small business yes sales, marketing as well as toilet cleaning are often the job of one person but is there a difference between marketing and sales or it is just the same thing?

Discuss

[jamhun]

If sales and marketing were the same thing, then why do large (and a lot of small) company's have seperate departments for each.



James

[Rainee Bows]

Isn't the marketing the bit that comes before the sale ?


marketing = getting the potential customers

sales = converting those customers


Rain
xxxx

[Zola de Cwtchi]

I think they are separate...

If i was producing a product i'd have,

A Marketing Dept- they would bring the product to the market place, advertising, feedback and freebies

A Sales Dept- they would be chasing the leads brought to the company by the Marketing Dept and to enforce the hard sell, whilst following up on previous orders.

I think they should be two separate Departments, individually doing different jobs of work to find AND consolidate BUYERS and to further SALES of said product.

However, there are Sales and Marketing Teams as well...different methods i guess...dependant on differing products...also dependant on size of company.

Is that what you meant Bryon?

[scotserve]

yes

However this was on the first tuesday forum ( quite an influential one at the time ) with a huge array of members from one man businesses up to banks and government bodies.
He was finding support for his views at the time which got me questioning my own understanding
To me Marketing is bring the product from production to the market, brand identity and awareness, sales is the conversion of the product to cash.

The way i tried to argue is that Bad marketing would have a disastrous effect on sales, yet Sales good or bad does not affect marketing in the same way so they must be separate.

Believe it or not this subject carried on for weeks with no clear agreement

[Zola de Cwtchi]

Seperate in concept and functionality...however, Reality maybe suggests it's poor John from 'Sales and Marketing' on his own doing it all by himself :P

Dependant on size of Company,

Definately TWO seperate departments with their own ways and means...with some crossover occassionally...i'd be inclined to stick a partition wall up in between the two to seperate them...Salespersons two a penny...Proper Marketing strategists are worth far more...or am i wrong?

Ive never been in either so can only offer thoughts

[Beautybase]

Agree with Byron

Sales and marketing are two different things. Marketing is everything that you do to reach your target audience and persuade prospects, and sales is everything you do to close the sale, but you need both processes. Well in a nutshell

Most of us I am assuming don't have the luxury of a marketing department~~~well speaking for myself, so I can see why that people often think they are one and the same as smaller companies/sole traders etc have to wear both hats and so those processes can appear seamless.


 

[Baa]

I don't think they are all that separate, they are part of the same process.

If they were separate without marketing would you make sales?

Advertising and marketing are another two you could debate until the cows come home, you could include promotion, publicity and public relations in this as well.

So how do I see it, the entire thing is generating income.

Marketing, public relations and publicity is education and impression, advertising and promotion is persuading and sales is the convincing aspect.

If you see these as entirely separate steps I think it is easy to lose you way. If it is all part of the same process you can set a focus for closure.

[Grifter]

I tend to think of it all as one. I.e that sales are just a small part of the marketing. As Baa was saying above about.

I.e
Marketing includes the advertising which may get them through the door. The actual look and feel of the shop on or offline is part of the marketing. How the sale is conducted leaves an impression so is also marketing. The aftersales service is huge marketing.

It's all marketing to me and a sale is not so much the conclusion but a part of. Sales may be the target but if it's not a one off one time sale then the focus must be on the marketing at all times.

[Grifter]

I remember the 80's marketing of the likes of:

BMW "the customer is king"

and

Marks and Spencers who brought in the revolutionary "it doesn't matter how long you've had it, bring it back and you're guaranteed a full refund" was brilliant. They get the odd bloke come in with a 3 year old shirt that a button has dropped off and they duly give a full refund but they did do well out of it.

[scotserve]

I don't think they are all that separate, they are part of the same process.

If they were separate without marketing would you make sales?

Advertising and marketing are another two you could debate until the cows come home, you could include promotion, publicity and public relations in this as well.

So how do I see it, the entire thing is generating income.

Marketing, public relations and publicity is education and impression, advertising and promotion is persuading and sales is the convincing aspect.

If you see these as entirely separate steps I think it is easy to lose you way. If it is all part of the same process you can set a focus for closure.

Yes I agree they are all part of the same process in a way but your business survive without marketing but your business cannot survive without sales, I see marketing as part of the same business but separate from the sales pitch.
Marketing and Sales should be linked together but IMO they are separate entities, in larger companies marketing is often farmed out, sub contracted if you like but sales force is internally employed another indicator to me that they are separate.

I am looking at this from the perspective of the components not from the business where one man ( woman ) does everything.

[Baa]

I'm not entirely sure what you mean there Scotserve. They are different but so intricately linked, business can't survive without sales I agree but can you seriously make sales without any marketing at all?

If people don't know you;ve something to sell ... they aren't going to buy surely?

[conran]

I've always thought that the title of Marketing indicates the person who forms the strategies and methods to increase brand awareness and promotion.

Sales is the term for the "foot soldier" actually implementing those methods to increase the sale of stock or services.

[cedarportfolio]

OK guys, so here's the cedar portfolio view on sales and marketing

Marketing is those peeps who sit in the cushty number in head office towers..... designing the latest ad campaign

Sales..... are the trooopers out there sweating their bits off actually doing something, trying to sell.

But for us in ecommerce land......we're both. We need to have thought about what we're trying to sell, how, we're doing it, etc etc......and then providing a suitable platform from which to sell!!

What I'd ideally like to say is this......the best sales people are the smartest ones, not the most hard working.....they use all of the marketing techniques to help......and so must we........


Vive le revolution!

Cedar